Aug 13, 2020
Brandon Anderson:
"The function of leadership is to produce more leaders, not more followers." Ralph Nader. I am Brandon Anderson and I'm a Tri-Cities Influencer.
Paul Casey:
One of the only ways change happens in a company is if people change their behavior and align it to the vision.
Speaker 3:
Raising the water level of leadership in the Tri-Cities of Eastern Washington, it's the Tri-Cities Influencer podcast. Welcome to the TCI podcast, where local leadership and self- leadership expert Paul Casey interviews local CEOs, entrepreneurs, and non-profit executives to hear how they lead themselves and their teams so we can all benefit from their wisdom and experience. Here's your host, Paul Casey of Growing Forward Services, coaching and equipping individuals and teams to spark breakthrough success.
Paul Casey:
Thanks for joining me for today's episode. So we've all had to adjust during the COVID season of the world that we're in right now, and one of the adjustments we've now had to make on top of that is technical difficulties with the podcast. So today you get me and I'm going to do a training on receiving feedback constructively, and then next time we'll be back to our fabulous influencers in the Tri-Cities that I get to interview. We'll dive in after checking with our Tri-City Influencers sponsors.
Preston House:
Hi, my name is Preston House and I'm the local owner of Papa John's Pizza right here in Tri-Cities.
Jesus Melendez:
I'm Jesus Melendez, Vice President and commercial lender with Community First Bank & HFG Trust.
Preston House:
When I moved here in 2009 with my family from Boise, Idaho, I knew I wanted to move from a franchise to a local business owner. I'd been working with Papa John's since I was 16 years old, so when it came time to open my own location here in my own community, I knew I needed some financial guidance from an organization who understood my needs as a small business owner.
Jesus Melendez:
Small business owners often have a lot on their plate. Employment, retirement plans, payroll, bills. Our mission is to become your financial partner for life and is motivated by providing people in our community, like Preston, with all the information and support they need all under one roof.
Preston House:
It's really simple. No matter what I need, all it takes is one phone call. No automated prompts. No call waiting. It's just a local business serving another local business.
Jesus Melendez:
For more information on how Community First Bank & HFG Trust can help you get back on track, visit www.community1st.com. That's www.community1ST.com.
Paul Casey:
Thank you for your support of leadership development in the Tri-Cities. So today we're going to talk about techniques for receiving feedback well. Stephen Covey said, “Don't consider yourself above feedback.” We all know that that would probably be an arrogant way, position or posture to be in, to say, "I'm above feedback." No, we all need it more. I'm going to start by saying, remember the Q-tip principle. Q-tip stands for Quit Taking It Personally, because feedback is all about your growth. Well, at least it should be. If you take things personally, you block that information from getting into your mind and your heart so that you can get better. Other people have information on you that's invisible to you. I'll say that again. Other people have info on you that's invisible to you.
Paul Casey:
We need people who will help flip the switch on to what we need to see. You might've seen the picture of the Johari window before. The Johari window has four quadrants and one of the quadrants talks about things that you know about yourself and everyone else knows about you. That's very transparent people. Then there is the quadrant of things you know about yourself, but not everybody knows about you.
Paul Casey:
These are the things you hold close to the vest. Some people have a higher standard of that. Others, they're an open book. You can read it on their face how they feel about everything. There's the category of things you don't know about yourself and no one else knows about you. You probably don't have to worry about that one too much right away. But then there's the quadrant, things you don't know about yourself, but other people know and observe about you. This is the blind spot quadrant. This is scary because the research says that most of us have between three and four blind spots. And you're like, "No, I don't." Well, that's why they call it a blind spot, right? Because you don't know it's there. So other people have information on you that's invisible to you. We need that feedback. That's why I think 360 degree feedbacks and reviews are great.
Paul Casey:
I wouldn't say it's great in an atmosphere of distrust. You've probably been in companies where people didn't trust one another, and that's not a great environment for a 360, because then everybody's wondering, "Who said that about me, and can we get retribution back at them and nail them in their 360?" That's just a disaster. But in a culture of trust, 360s are great because everyone is helping each other get better. Ken Blanchard said, "True servant leaders want feedback because they're anxious to know whether their actions with their people are helpful and effective." So the sooner you start getting it, the more time you have to pivot. Now here's another thing about feedback: the receiver is in charge of the effectiveness of feedback. You could have delivered feedback fantastically, but then if the receiver doesn't receive it because something's going on or is broken inside of them, doesn't matter how beautifully that you delivered that feedback.
Paul Casey:
Same going the other direction. We're going to be talking about receiving feedback today. So even if the other person used such caution and care and love and concern for you in delivering it, if you are broken on the inside and you're blocking that feedback from getting in, it's not going to help anyone. So the receiver's in charge. To get better at receiving feedback, I would encourage you to ask someone for feedback every day. Okay, maybe not every day, but you get the point. Way more than you are now. A lot of people never ask for feedback. If we ask for it more, you can see how you get more comfortable with it because it'd be, "Hey, can you give us some feedback on this email I'm about to send the vendor?" Or, "Can you give you some feedback on this report that I'm about to send my boss?" or, "Can you give me some feedback on how I treated that last customer on the phone?"
Paul Casey:
If you get a lot of feedback around you from people who care about you and wants you to succeed, it's just going to be neutral. It's not going to be emotionally charged like feedback often is. And then I had one employee that once asked for the last 5%. I said, "What's that?" And she said, "Well, the last 5% is that thing you're holding back, Paul, from telling me. Because you're being really nice in this performance review, but there's probably still something that... I'm just going to give you permission. Go ahead and speak into my life." I was blown away. I was like, "Whoa." Well, there wasn't anything that I could think of because she was always so open to feedback.
Paul Casey:
But if you ask someone for the last 5%, that thing that they're holding back from telling you, you're probably going to get something really valuable. They're going to say it really nicely because you asked so nicely for it. They'll be like, "Well, there is this one thing." And then when you really get that, it's like, "Oh boy, I can really fine tune that. Thanks for that feedback." Rebecca Shambaugh says, "Seek feedback and use it to calibrate your own performance standards." Sheila Heen wrote a book called Thank You for the Feedback, and I would encourage you to get this book if this is a struggle for you. Maybe you get defensive when you get feedback, and it's just really difficult to hear any kind of criticism at all. Sheila Heen says, "There are three trigger reactions that block feedback from getting in." The first one she calls truth.
Paul Casey:
I don't believe the content of the feedback is accurate or helpful so I'm not going to let it in. Like, "That is just bologna, what you are saying to me right now." If you're telling yourself that, and you're not trying to receive the little nugget of truth that might be in there, it doesn't get in. It doesn't help anyone. The second trigger reaction that blocks feedback is relationship, where you don't trust the giver of the feedback. Whether that's the credibility of that person, like, "They don't know what I do all day," or, "They haven't stood in my shoes before," or you don't trust the positive intent of the giver like, "This person's just trying to sock it to me," or, "They're singling me out for some reason." If you don't trust that that person cares for you and really wants you to improve, then probably it's going to be blocked.
Paul Casey:
A third thing that Sheila Heen says in this book, Thank You for the Feedback, that blocks feedback from getting in, is your identity. Because of something broken in me, the story I'm telling myself is distorting the feedback. Either right now I'm overwhelmed so I really can't receive yet another thing. It feels like piling on. Or I'm threatened by this feedback. Like, "Maybe I'm going to get fired if this person keeps talking about this thing," or, "I'm ashamed." Like, "You're shining the spotlight on me and I don't like that," or, "I'm just off balance right now." Something's going on in my life. Maybe I'm not feeling well, or I'm going through some kind of major transition in my life and so something is broken in me. And so I can't really hear that clearly. There's just so much internal noise going on. So truth, relationship, and identity are three trigger reactions that block feedback. I encourage you to pick up that book, Thank You for the Feedback by Sheila Heen.
Paul Casey:
All right, let's get really practical. Here's some ways to better receive feedback constructively. Number one is to focus on the content, not the person. Focus on the content, not the person. So go in assuming that that person has positive intent. You can think about how this would color the rest of the conversation. If you are sitting there, the person is right in front of you and before they even begin talking, you think, "That person has positive intent in communicating this with me." You can just see that it just opens up lots of, well, I'm just going to say openness, right, for receiving that feedback and for this to go well. Also, have the posture of looking for the nugget of wisdom in the feedback. I heard one speaker say, "Criticism is like chewing gum. You chew for the flavor and you spit out the rest."
Paul Casey:
Sometimes when you're receiving feedback and that person doesn't know you very well, it may be a lot of bologna. They just don't know the whole situation. They probably shouldn't have been giving you feedback because they haven't done their homework, but there's probably a nugget in there of truth that we can still benefit from. So chew for the good and spit out the rest. Number two, listen calmly and attentively. Listen calmly and attentively. So tune in fully when the person is talking, demonstrating your willingness to listen. This will really help create a safe environment. If you think about that phrase, a safe environment, right? A hostile environment would be the absolute opposite of a safe environment, and that's where everybody feels tense and on edge and something could explode at any moment.
Paul Casey:
A safe environment is this peaceful place where we're just having a conversation here. They feel comfortable to share. You feel comfortable to listen. You can think about other behaviors that you might put off or signals that creates safety for the speaker. Monitor your body's signals because we're always putting off signals with our body language or our tone of voice, or with some of the words that we use. I would encourage you to manage those emotional reactions. Think about your natural facial expression. For some of us, because of our personality style, that may be a natural frown. Well, if you're frowning big time or have a scowl on your face when someone's giving you feedback, to them that's not a safe environment. Maybe your body language, you can think about leaning forward, you have your pen handy and you're just ready to receive versus slumping down in your chair, your arms folded, leaning away from the speaker.
Paul Casey:
Your tone of voice being open and, "Yes, I just want to receive this feedback. Thank you so much for it," versus accusatory and ready to just lash out at any moment. Dr. Janis Spring says, "As soon as you start to think about how this person's offended you, say the word 'stop' to yourself." I know that might sound a little, maybe even childish to say 'stop' to yourself. But I think that is a great way to break the pattern, to change the state that you are in. Any time you're giving yourself negative self-talk, it's okay to say to yourself, "Stop." I do this to myself. I'll be like, "No, no, no." when I just start spiraling and spiraling. I'll just go, "Stop." And that just wakes me up for a moment and I have to change and insert a more positive thought or more helpful thought in that place where that negativity was.
Paul Casey:
Number three is to clarify the feedback. Clarify the feedback. So as soon as they have spoken that feedback to you, you're going to start feeling a feeling right away, especially if it's negative feedback, because they just put you on the spot in some way, shape or form. So I like to say feel a feeling, ask a question. As soon as you start feeling a feeling, buy yourself a little bit of emotional white space by asking a clarifying question at that moment. Find out some more information that will help you understand your specific behavior or patterns or its impact on other people, like the person that's giving you this feedback. Feel a feeling, ask a question. When you do ask that question, I'm going to encourage you to be mindful of using an interrogating tone. Yeah. We all know what this is. The interrogating tone, right?
Paul Casey:
Let me just give you six words that we could... When I'm in a group and I'm doing this training, we'll do this little game. The phrase, "What do you mean by that?" Right? We can say that with an interrogating tone. "What do you mean by that?" Right? All of a sudden, we just went from a safe environment to more of a hostile environment. Now I could say this so pleasantly, like, "What do you mean by that?" Or just a simple, neutral response like, "Tell me what you mean by that." That's hungry and wanting to know. But it's the same six words, it's just the tone of voice changes to put you in a learning atmosphere, a learning posture or a I'm going to now start lashing back at the giver of the feedback posture.
Paul Casey:
Number four, acknowledge the other person's concerns. Acknowledge the other person's concerns. Show that you understand this other person's perspective. The sender, receiver loop then gets closed. In all communication there's a sender and a receiver. When you show that you have picked up what they were laying down, it closes that loop and it allows for more discussion. That person doesn't really need to just keep going and going because it's like, "Okay, I got where you're coming from on this issue." Indicate then your willingness to address the concern. Now that doesn't mean you're going to just run out the door and you've got to change that complete behavior. It's just that, "I'm chewing on that right now. I'm processing that." Some of you that are listening to this podcast are more introverted and you need to process or mull over things. Of course, if you're in that category, you also know you can go into the overthink mode.
Paul Casey:
Like, "Wait, wait, wait, let me overthink that." Yeah, you don't want to go that far, but you do want to mull over this to say, "What is the flavor that I need to keep chewing on?" Ask questions while this person is still in front of you to clarify, and to learn. Stay curious to find out their perspective. I like to say, "When you get furious, get curious." I don't know if you've heard that little rhyme before. When you get furious, get curious. So when you start getting triggered by the feedback and what it's doing inside of you, and you start feeling a feeling inside, ask another question. Try to find out why this person has this perspective. Summarize the other person's key points to confirm their intended message was received. So again, this is part of closing a loop on sender, receiver. When you actually say, "So what I'm hearing you saying is that I'm doing this and I'm doing this and I'm doing this, and the impact that's having on your perspective is this."
Paul Casey:
And then they can of course say yes or no to your receiving, how you paraphrased that back. If it's a yes, that's great. We've landed this communication. If it's a no, that person then has an opportunity to go, “No, that's not exactly what I'm saying." And then they can clarify so that you can receive it a little bit better. It's really the only way to show that you got what they gave. Step four. Step four is to acknowledge the other person's concern. Before we head into the rest of receiving feedback constructively, let's shout out to our sponsor.
Preston House:
Hi, my name is Preston House and I'm the local owner of Papa John's Pizza right here in Tri-Cities.
Jesus Melendez:
I'm Jesus Melendez, Vice President and commercial lender with Community First Bank & HFG Trust.
Preston House:
When I moved here in 2009 with my family from Boise, Idaho, I knew I wanted to move from a franchise to a local business owner. I'd been with Papa John's since I was 16 years old, so when it came time to open my own location here in my own community, I knew I needed some financial guidance from an organization who understood my needs as a small business owner.
Jesus Melendez:
Small business owners often have a lot on their plate. Employment, retirement plans, payroll, bills. Our mission is to become your financial partner for life and is motivated by providing people in our community, like Preston, with all the information and support they need all under one roof.
Preston House:
It's really simple. No matter what I need, all it takes is one phone call. No automated prompts. No call waiting. It's just a local business serving another local business.
Jesus Melendez:
For more information on how Community First Bank and HFG Trust can help you get back on track, visit www.community1stcom. That's www.community1ST.com.
Paul Casey:
All right, we are on to number five for receiving feedback constructively. We have talked about focusing on the content, not the person. Listening calmly and attentively. Clarifying the feedback and then acknowledging the other person's concerns. So let's go to number five, which is, avoid defending or overexplaining. Avoid defending or overexplaining. A key to being coachable is to drop your defensiveness by reminding yourself what really matters. If you can't accept bad news and advice, you can't learn, change or grow. Whoa. If you can't accept bad news or advice, you can't learn, change or grow. So we don't want to be in that boat. So I'm going to encourage you here to correct any inaccuracies you hear in a non-defensive manner, right? It's okay to stand on truth of what happened or what didn't happen. But we're going to do that, again, with that non-defensive tone. If needed, we may actually have to take a time out before responding especially if you are prone to defensiveness.
Paul Casey:
I'm going to encourage you to take that time out and say, "Hey, can we come back in an hour?" or, "Can we pick this up first thing in the morning?" or, "Can I have some time to process this?" Because now they have confirmed that you heard what they said, but you now need to sort out what you want to say. Sometimes we start blubbering back and then it turns into something ugly after a while. And then we go, "Ah, why did I say that?" Well, it's because you were a little bit in shock. So make a repair if you do start talking and it may have come out wrong. We've all had those situations where we just utter something out loud and then we're like, "Oh shoot. I wish I could have those words back."
Paul Casey:
You know what? It's okay to start speaking and go, "You know, that is just so not true. Okay. Actually, can I back up for a moment and restart? What I'm trying to say is..." People actually respect you if you restart and you make a correction or make a repair if you said something with a nasty tone. Let's go to number six. Welcome suggestions. Welcome suggestions. So focus on solutions for the future. It stops you from yelling at the closed door and moving toward the open door. What I mean by that metaphor is the closed door is what happened in the past. That cannot be changed, right? It happened. That's the closed door. And if we keep yelling at the closed door like, "That didn't happen that way," or, "I have my perspective on that," and we just keep yelling at that, it doesn't really help us focus forward.
Paul Casey:
So if you want to move toward the open door, you're going to start thinking about how I can become better. Ask that person who just gave you that negative feedback one idea on what you could do differently. I sure don't like it when somebody dumps the dump truck of negative feedback on me and then just leaves, right? So that hit and run mentality. And I'm like, "What do I do with that?" So I like to give the giver of the feedback a little bit of accountability by saying, "Can you give me one thing that I could do differently to address that issue you just brought up." What you're doing is adopting the mindset of how this person and this interaction can help you be better. Turn failure into fertilizer. There's a little tweetable moment there.
Paul Casey:
It's not mine though. I stole it from somebody. Turn failure into fertilizer. Whatever that yucky thing is that you're feeling, you're going to turn that into something that can grow. It does stink for a while, but then it's going to turn into a beautiful flower if you do apply that feedback. I would encourage you to take notes where appropriate. Oftentimes taking notes, just the movement of your pen on paper, calms your nerves and it shows that you're also taking this seriously. Now, sometimes when people don't take notes, I'm wondering, "How are you going to remember what we talked about later?" Especially if it was a task or something they needed to go do. But even if it's just for purely for getting your energy out in a physical way, which is writing on the paper, that often buys us a little bit of emotional white space.
Paul Casey:
Number seven is to thank the person for sharing the feedback. Just like that book title, thank the person for sharing the feedback. Remember, it would have been safer for them to do nothing, right? They could have just let you struggle. It's very challenging to find people with experience, who you respect, who will be straight with you. So they had alternatives, right? This shows appreciation that others cared enough about you to share their perceptions. Because the alternatives are, they could have kept it to themselves and you would have kept struggling or causing a mess around you that you didn't even know you were doing. They could have told somebody else. They could have gossiped about you behind your back. They could have gone above your head to your boss. Man, there's so many other things that they could have done in that situation, but they chose to speak to you. Just that perspective right there probably gives you a little bit more compassion for the giver of the feedback. It also positively reinforces and encourages others to provide feedback.
Paul Casey:
If this situation goes well and it gets out that it went well, somebody confronted you and you took it really well, then other people can bring things up to each other. Hopefully it'll set a culture of, "Feedback is just something that we do here to get better." Number eight is to evaluate the feedback you received and decide how you may use it. Evaluate the feedback you received and decide how you may use it. So if you know right on the spot that you screwed up or there's something you could do better, state right there what actions you're going to take, if that's appropriate to do that. Again, oftentimes we need time to mull, right? So give further thought and consideration to the feedback received. Andre Gido says, "One completely overcomes only what one assimilates." So we've got to let it go down into our mind and our heart and really think about, "Okay, so how was I wrong? How did I contribute to that problem, that issue?"
Paul Casey:
Oftentimes after we bounce it off our spouse or a good friend or a coach, then it's like, "Okay, now I can see why that person brought that situation up to me." Choose if and when to act. Okay? If and when to act. So I said 'if' because sometimes there's nothing you can do with that feedback. It's just FYI. Other times, it's like, "Yep, I need to do this, and now I need to decide what form. Do I need to apologize to someone? Is it a big group? Is it one person? Do I need to communicate on a more timely manner next time?" What fits in your frame? When I do this as a seminar, I'll have a picture of a person in a frame, and I think about what of that feedback will fit in the frame that's now going to be a part of you from now on, and what's still outside the frame that you're not going to do anything with.
Paul Casey:
Bill George says, "The key to growing as a leader is to narrow the gap. The gap of how you see yourself and how you want to be seen by developing a deep self-awareness that comes from straight feedback and honest exploration of yourself, followed by a concerted effort to make changes." Really that's this point right here, a concerted effort to make changes. So a quick summary of receiving feedback constructively. We talked about Q-tip. Quit Taking It Personally. We talked about the three things that block feedback. Truth, relationship, and identity. Then I gave you some constructive points here. Focusing on the content, not the person. Listening calmly and attentively. Clarifying the feedback. Acknowledging that other person's concerns. Not defending or overexplaining. Welcoming suggestions. Thanking the person for sharing the feedback and then evaluating that feedback you receive to decide how you may use it.
Paul Casey:
So what? Now what? What are you going to do with this information? Which of those eight points is something like, "Yeah, I got to do that better when I receive feedback?" Because anytime you receive a training, whether it's a podcast like this or a formal training or a webinar, it's important to apply it within 72 hours. Maybe it's again just saying to yourself, "I need to ask for more feedback," or, "I need to ask my boss for that extra 5%," or, "I need to not be defensive at conversations." Whatever it is, I would encourage you to apply it even in the next 72 hours so that you don't forget it. I'll close with an article that I've saved for many years and it's by a gentleman named Todd Rhodes. And he says, "What are you going to do with your stones?"
Paul Casey:
So stones in this illustration is when someone throws a stone at you, which I'm going to liken here to criticism or poking at you, or just some negative feedback that comes your way. You've got some choices of what to do with those stones, okay? You get hit by the stone. One thing you could do is you could throw stones. "Your first inclination," Rhodes says, "is to pick up these stones and hurl them back where they came from." Right? Somebody gives you criticism. You're going to hurl it right back with your own criticism. It makes us feel better for a moment. It takes away the pressing need to consider whether or not that criticism leveled at us is at all founded. So that's one. We could choose to complain about the stones. If you can't attack back, maybe you can at least complain about it.
Paul Casey:
Somehow complaining to others makes us feel bad. Complaining serves no purpose other than to make us feel better in the moment and to bring other people into our problem. When we complain to others, we're really asking for their support and for them to take our side of things, but it doesn't even achieve anything positive. So we could throw stones. We could complain about the stones. We could stumble on the stones. Sometimes when problems arise, we keep it to ourselves. We sit, we ponder, we stew and all the while our main job functions suffer because we're dwelling on the problem. Maybe you're a stuffer. In essence, we allow that stone, that problem to grind all our positive work to a halt. This has crippled many leaders because we stop dead in our tracks, afraid to move because we don't want any more stones to hit us.
Paul Casey:
A fourth negative option. We could throw stones, complain about them, stumble, or we can climb over the stones. This is like steamrolling right over them, right? You've got a problem with someone on your team who disagrees with you on a certain proposal, climbing over the stone would be to line up people who you know support you to make sure your proposal goes through while ignoring that one person who disagrees with you. So you ignore the problem and you climb over it and around it, rather than working through it. What you'll find out in that case is that stone is going to reappear bigger and harder to climb over than before. So those are five negative options. I'm going to encourage you, and this author Todd Rhodes says to build with the stones. The last option is to take those stones and build with them.
Paul Casey:
You have to pick them up. You have to inspect them and you have to decide best how they fit into the plan. Don't throw them. Don't complain. Don't stumble on them or climb over them. You actually work with them. Tackle those problems as soon as humanly possible. It's only when you do that these stones can be used as a positive influence in your life. So I'm hoping if you've got nothing else, that last illustration of what are you going to do with your stones is going to help you as you try to receive feedback a little bit more constructively. All right, let me wrap up our podcast today with a resource to recommend. It's a quirky one, but it's more of a time management one. I just bought this called a hex timer. One of my clients had one of these. A hex timer looks like a little hexagon and there's the clock feature on the top, as some of you can have on your desk.
Paul Casey:
And then there's a timer for five, 15, 30, 45 and 60 minutes on the other edges or sides of the hexagon. As soon as you turn the timer to, like, the five minutes, it automatically starts a five minute timer and then it will go off. It also has an alarm feature on it. If you really want to chunk your productivity, you may want to do it in chunks of 60 minutes or 45 or 30, and use this timer as a way to alert you when you have given deep work time, and then when you need to take a break. So it's called a hex timer and you can find it at znewtech.com, Z-N-E-W-T-E-C-H.com. Again, this is Paul Casey. I want to thank you all for listening to the Tri-City Influencer podcast. I want to thank our TCI sponsor and invite to support them again. We appreciate you making this podcast possible so we can collaborate and help inspire leaders here in the Tri-Cities.
Paul Casey:
Finally, one more leadership tidbit for the road to help you make a difference in your circle of influence. It is from Jim Roan. He says, "Goals. There's no telling what you can do when you get inspired by them. There's no telling what you can do when you believe in them. And there's no telling what will happen when you act upon them." Until next time, KGF. Keep Growing Forward.
Speaker 3:
Thank you to our listeners for tuning into today's show. Paul Casey is on a mission to add value to leaders by providing practical tools and strategies that reduce stress in their lives and on their teams so that they can enjoy life and leadership and experience their key desired results. If you'd like more help from Paul in your leadership development, connect with him at growingforward@paulcasey.org for a consultation that can help you move past your current challenges and create a strategy for growing your life or your team forward. Paul would also like to help you restore your sanity to your crazy schedule and getting your priorities done everyday by offering you his free Control My Calendar checklist. Go to www.takebackmycalendar.com for that productivity tool or open a text message to 72000 and type the word growing.
Speaker 6:
Tri-Cities Influencer podcast was recorded at Fuse SPC by Bill Wagner of Safe Strategies.